Taping of 'Justice Talking' turns heated

"Chill out." This is what Religious Studies Professor Michael Eric Dyson instructed his fellow debater, and it might as well have been the theme of the evening. During a taping of the radio show Justice Talking last night, a Wistar Institute audience became increasingly agitated and vocal as Penn's own Dyson debated University of Michigan Philosophy Professor Carl Cohen on affirmative action. The debate centered on the upcoming arguments before the Supreme Court regarding the admissions policies at the University of Michigan. Dyson, who was introduced as a "hip-hop intellectual" by moderator Margot Adler, represented the pro-affirmative action side of the debate. Cohen, who represented the other side, tried to limit his discussion solely to the constitutional questions, yet was repeatedly drawn into the social justice debate that Dyson presented -- a debate to which many in the audience chose to return when the floor was finally opened for questions. "The cases are complicated and interesting," Cohen said after the taping, "and I had hoped that we would argue them." He did admit that he was not surprised by Dyson's decision to avoid the legal questions in trying to create a much broader debate about race in America. During the course of that debate, Cohen stressed that the Supreme Court ruling would have to be based on the 14th Amendment's guarantee of racial equality, saying that "the law on the matter is perfectly clear." But Dyson opted for a different approach. He frequently referred to "the United States of Amnesia" and stated that "affirmative action is an admittedly precarious but necessary tool." But cold, hard facts quickly gave way to passionate rebuttles. Both men spoke fervently -- often interrupting and talking over each other for long periods of time as Adler tried to regain control. Although she was largely successful in keeping the discourse civil, there were several occasions when both speakers seemed exasperated. At one point during a long rebuttal from Dyson, Cohen interrupted out of apparent frustration asking, "Are you finished yet?" Later, Cohen became increasingly animated responding to an allegation of racial insensitivity, prompting Dyson to tell him to "chill out." But Dyson, too, found himself accused of insensitivity by an audience member who claimed he didn't care about the suffering of other minorities. The exchange eventually prompted him to respond with "I ain't playahating Asians." Afterwards, opinion on the debate was mixed. Several of the audience members seemed to think that both men had been debating points that ran parallel to each other. Still, others felt that just the fact a debate had been held was important. "I thought that the debate was very spirited and necessary," said School of Social Work graduate student Jasmine Oglesby. "My only concern was that the insistence of Professor Cohen to confine the debate only to the legal case at hand ignored the systemic ripple effect that this case can have on race in America." Although the frequent interruptions won't make it on the air, those interested in hearing the edited debate can listen for it on WHYY-91FM sometime in late March.